ADR - Episode 632: Kane Parson's Backrooms (Film)

[00:00:05] Welcome to Al Dente Rigamortis, I'm Review Cultist. I'm the Gamer in Yellow. I'm Aaron J. Shelton. And I'm, I'm invaded, I've, I went through the threshold. You've no clipped through the, through a wall in the Kamehose. Now I'm here.

[00:00:36] Well, at a party. Mm-hmm. How for sure it is, because we could actually talk about something. Yeah. Because, uh, yeah, Real Talk guys. Al Dente Real Talk, Kane Parsons, The Backrooms, uh, his feature film, uh, by A24. These are our thoughts. Uh, so we've, we've all seen the movie. Um, and, uh, yeah, um, I guess, uh, well, let's start off with like, um, what do we all, what do we all think? Like, yay, nay?

[00:01:05] I mean, I loved it. Definitely a yay. Yeah. Yeah. I, I definitely enjoyed it. It was, I, I think my exact like, uh, reaction after the, after the credits started rolling was this was exactly what I wanted. I didn't know what it was going to be, honestly. Cause like, I've read backroom stuff. We've done that before on the show, but like, how do you extrapolate that into an actual narrative? You know? Yeah.

[00:01:31] Well, and, and Kane Parsons' Backrooms is set, uh, is separate from like other people's interpretations online of the backrooms. Like it, it isn't like different levels, like back, like the, the yellow wallpaper and the, the carpet and all that stuff isn't like level zero of like level infinity. Um, like it's not like gamified. Uh, it's more, it's like surreal and, and, um, uh, there's more of like a, there's more

[00:02:00] of a through line for, uh, for Kane Parsons vision of it. Um, but yeah. Uh, so Aaron, um, I guess, uh, do you want to do, would you like to go first to see like, like on, uh, any like observations and thoughts of the movie? Yeah. Uh, so yeah. Oh, backroom. I absolutely love this. I had to, my friend who I, one friend who I went with, uh, we had to postpone like three times just due to some, everything's fine, but some family stuff.

[00:02:29] And I'm just like, I'm about to see this without you. I cannot be spoiled by the internet. Yeah. Um, but no, I really enjoyed it. Um, I think the main takeaway for me is that I, I really liked whenever it wasn't trying to be a regular movie. Not that the, the character stuff or the development on the, on the two leads, uh,

[00:02:59] I thought their stories were like bad necessarily. They're definitely, they are definitely just a little less, but when it got into, I guess, Kane Parsons, like familiar territory for him, that's where it's like, yeah, this rules. Yeah. Are you talking about like the found footage? Uh, we're like, uh, where the main character has to like, goes to get proof. And like, so he gets like a camera and like his, his employees.

[00:03:24] I think he's referring to is all the places, all the, um, scenes that do not take place in the back rooms, whether it is through a, uh, uh, first person perspective or third person perspective. Those are the ones he's referring to. I think. Yes. Correct. Um, yeah. Cause Clark entering for the first time was so like, it's, it's just weirdly gripping to

[00:03:51] watch him explore, uh, that first part. And then the, then the horror aspect of it after that, once he gets in deep enough. Um, but yeah, overall excellent work. Like this kid's going places. Yeah. There was a movie at 13 or whatever he is. No, no. Yeah. Okay. That's a meme. There was a meme four years ago where he was like viral at 16.

[00:04:18] Like that was like going all doing the rounds because of the original back rooms found footage, uh, video they did on his YouTube channel that blew up. And like, I think that like that, that got his like, that got the attention of like a 24 and such. Um, and then now it's like, uh, this guy, I think that's like, I think that's like, this kid, uh, like Kane Parson did all this, this, this, and this he's his, uh, he's age 20. Like he's the youngest, he's the youngest director of a 24.

[00:04:44] It's like, yeah, it's really actually really like all the memes aside. It's really inspiring to like, see this guy, like come into his own and actually like makes like, like just make something so like, uh, beloved for sure. Yeah. And honestly, like the memes are there because they're true, you know, they're not like making fun of them. It's just like, he is actually like, like it's amazing what he's done with how few years he has under his belt right now.

[00:05:15] I mean, I, I did see there, there, there's a couple that made fun of it. Like, uh, although people make fun of everything, like I saw, okay. So for like, for instance, there's one's like backrooms director, Kane Parsons had reportedly killed the Hasashi family. He is 20 years old. Yeah. Like, like that's, that's the, like, that's the template basically. Like he has done this, this, this, like he is 20 years old. Yeah. But even that, that joke is there based on a meme.

[00:05:44] That is not a joke, you know? No. Yeah. It's just jokifying the meme. It's not jokifying him because he is good at what he does. True. Yeah. Yeah. I think that the backs, the backroom backstory is, I think in an interview, he was saying that within a week of posting the first short, he was having like general meetings. Oh, really? Like they have been like from the beginning, they're like, we want to make this a movie. And it's just, you know, it took four years. When did he post? What was it?

[00:06:14] Four years ago. Like four years ago is when the first one came out. Like 20. First backrooms one they did? His first, yeah. The, the, the one that got like the, yeah, the backrooms, uh, film footage. Um, let me double check here. Oh, he's been, he's been working his tail off. Yeah. Four years. Well, I mean, that's like kind of a normal sort of turnaround for a movie, isn't it? Uh. Yeah. It usually takes a few years. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:06:42] I think he developed, developed development for sure. Mm. It says four years on, on YouTube. Yeah. September 23rd. Okay. No, that's, that's wrong. Okay. January 7th, 2022. Wow. Again, like this kid was in high school when he made the first movie, when he made the first video. Um. And then it was approached by people to make a movie while he's still like going to school. Yeah.

[00:07:13] Amazing. Well, it is, does currently have, um. Oh my God, is that 85, like over 85 million views on, on, uh, on YouTube, the, the back rooms, uh, found footage. So. The first one I imagine. Yeah. Mm. Um, and it's interesting because I've also heard like, uh, like obviously this one did very well. Like it had, I think like a $10 million budget, um, something around the, along that. And as of like the first weekend, it made like 83 million.

[00:07:45] Um, so. That's pretty impressive. I've, I've heard, uh, again, like from, I think interviews with Kane, uh, that I think he's also like in, like he's in talks right now, like either for a sequel or like, I think what he wants to do is, um, a TV series. Like now that's kind of open, it's opened up to that, um, possibility. And he would like a, a TV series, I think for his, his version of the back rooms. Yeah. TV would be better. I think.

[00:08:13] Cause it, you could slow down the slow burn horror even more. Yeah. Cause you're not rushing to get it done in an hour and a half. Yeah. There's a, I think it's, it's probably better for his haste as well. And I was, I watched back watching back rooms, maybe think about like some of the other horror moves I like. And weirdly I'm thinking about evil dead too, which is one of my favorites, but it is a

[00:08:40] horror movie where you don't need, what do you know about Ash? Nothing. He works at a store. The is from Michigan. Um, but like they're effective and like back rooms is kind of a, it works best when it is a quote unquote thrill ride sort of horror. Where, where I think it's like, it's, it's about that.

[00:09:08] I guess throw it around might not be the right word, but like, it's about the gags. There's, it's like, it's about the atmosphere and then what's going around the corner over what is the story? Yeah. Like the, with the back rooms, a lot of the time with the videos that you see, not just his, but other people's as well. They're all, um, uh, what's that term where you just got thrown into the, into a story at the start of it, but you're like in the middle of the media res. Yeah.

[00:09:39] There are a lot like that because like, I remember there was another back rooms video where like a guy is recording himself skateboarding and then whoop, I'm in the back rooms. Like we don't know nothing about this person. I don't even know his name. All I see is his skateboard and his feet. And then he's in the back rooms. Yeah. There's a lot of, I think that's also, yeah. Uh, the, an anthology of just different experiences in the back rooms would is I think also like a strength of this series or it would be a strength of this.

[00:10:06] Um, I think you and I, Aaron have, have watched, um, all of the, all of Kim pick up Kim Parson's like other back rooms videos, I think. Correct. Yes. Um, and I did find like, like it's sort of like a combination of like, there's the, the, the kind of, uh, almost like analog horror, um, async corporation, like work videos or like these videos that like explain the async corporation and their involvement with finding or the discovery of the back rooms and such.

[00:10:36] Um, and then there's these like, it's interspersed, like the videos on, on his YouTube channel are interspersed with these other ones that are just basically like found footage of other victims who have like found a null zone and no clipped into the back rooms that, uh, into from different points of, uh, points of contact. So like, again, we got the first one, like found footage, which is like the guys, like this kid's like filming, uh, uh, like a high school film project. And then he no clips, like while they're doing some outtakes.

[00:11:03] Um, there's one where like a girl discovers there's like a space, there's like a little, like, like foot sized, like, like, like one foot by one foot, like square in her garage that like you can throw something in and it just vanishes. And then it, there's like a, it basically expands and then she gets no clipped into the back rooms. Um, there's even some footage of like, there's a car like driving down like a highway and it just no clips through the, through the road. Yeah.

[00:11:30] Um, and, um, so yeah, I think that's definitely back rooms has some, not to, uh, it has some mileage with that kind of thing. Not too, I didn't mean to do that, but it was the, it was like the best thing. Um, should we, I guess also we should probably maybe like give a, like just a, like a brief synopsis or rundown of the, of the movie. Um, do you think, or yeah. I mean, yeah.

[00:11:58] Cause some people may have not seen the movie, but we'll be spoiling it for them. But if you don't want spoilers, then skip to whatever timestamp that you're going to give, I mean, if they're, if they're like checking us out, they, if you're at this point, like you, we, we've given our initial recommendations, like we all recommend this movie, go check it out and then come back and, and listen to us, um, bring up our thoughts of on the movie. Yeah. Listen to us on the ride home from the movie theater. Yeah, exactly. That's the way to do it.

[00:12:27] Um, yeah, I guess, I guess like a synopsis for the movie is, um, there's this arc architect turned, um, uh, furniture store manager, uh, Clark, um, his therapist, Mary and his two employees, uh, Clark's two employees at the, at the furniture store. Um, uh, those, that's the main cast plus, uh, the scientist named Phil, who's like from async. That's like observing things in the back rooms.

[00:12:56] Uh, Clark goes to, uh, goes to therapy because he's got some issues. Um, like he's been kicked out of his, uh, his house by his wife, uh, because he has anger issues and all that kind of stuff. Um, his, uh, furniture store is struggling, um, to say the least. And then one night he discovers while sleeping in his furniture store, cause he doesn't have anywhere to go. Um, he discovers there is this space on the wall down on the, on the, on the basement floor that he can pass through.

[00:13:26] And he goes through and it's into the back rooms, this large, like sprawling complex of, uh, randomly, almost seemingly randomly generated, um, uh, yellow wallpapered space. Uh, for a moment, I forgot how he found the crap, the, uh, the passage through the back rooms, but it's because like the lights were off down there cause he's have power issues and he's walking around and he just like sees like a vertical slid of light in the wall where there shouldn't be one. And that's how he found it. Yeah. That was so, that was like genius. Yeah.

[00:13:55] Also to me, it was so effective. Yeah. I also, I really liked like when they're down, when he was down there with like the electrician guy and they find, and he, and the electrician guy's like, what's this like switch to? And it's just like this switch box. It's like randomly generated, like on the wall, on the outside of the back rooms. That was so good. I like, I saw that. I was like, oh my God, that's like, they're flicking it. Nothing's nothing's turned off or on. Um, yeah, that was good.

[00:14:23] Um, and then, yeah, so, uh, uh, Clark tries to tell his therapist, Mary about this whole situation. She's not really believing him. So he goes and tries to get proof. He takes on his, he takes his employees, uh, with a camera into the back rooms that he's been exploring for like a few days or weeks. Um, and they go down into a spot where he has, he can't really get down without help because it's like a really like steep slope.

[00:14:50] And that's where we encounter some kind of mysterious like creature that's down there, uh, amongst like a bunch of just like detritus and laundry and like, and like clothing and stuff, which again, this is, I guess our, our, uh, our rundown here is going to be more of like, also have some thoughts in there because when there's down in the laundry and like when, uh, when the, uh, the one kid was down there, did you guys notice? That like amongst the, the piles of, of like dirty clothes or like, uh, like all that like

[00:15:16] stuff, you notice his, uh, his, um, uh, apartheid, like his like a stop apartheid shirt was in the pile, um, that he was wearing that. Yeah. That he was wearing when we first see him like days, like earlier in the video, in the movie, in the movie. I did not catch that. Yeah. Um, also I did notice also some async, uh, bodies, like some async, uh, hazmat suit bodies, uh, working in among the, uh, yeah.

[00:15:44] So, um, and then, yeah, then in this point, uh, the creature gets the, uh, the employees and Clark kind of gets stuck in the back rooms. Uh, then we cut to a few, sometime later, Mary, uh, eventually goes to investigate, um, what happened to Clark because he, she gets a message from him, like a call from him saying that like, he's found the back rooms and he won't be coming back or something like that. So she goes to investigate.

[00:16:11] She finds the back rooms, um, through a fly that no clips through the wall. Um, which again, I, I love that. Like, there's just like, not just like people are clipping through, but like animals can also clip through this thing. Mm-hmm. Was the fly flying or do you like walk along the wall and then just what? I think, yeah, I think some of it was like on the wall and then it just went in and it just like vanished when it went to the, the certain spot of the wall. Mm-hmm.

[00:16:37] Um, and then she goes exploring and finds Clark and then, uh, Clark kind of has gone nuts in the back rooms. Um, we are given, we are shown, uh, we were shown earlier, but we are, uh, uh, we get the, the still lifes, the, um, the, the remembered people that, uh, that kind of lurk in the back rooms as well. Um, that Clark has been, uh, using and abusing in various ways.

[00:17:07] Um, and also, uh, we find out that yes, his, uh, his employees are indeed dead as like the head of one of them is in the fridge that they're in, uh, after he takes a Mary captive and explains to her like what's going on and such. Um, and then Mary has what I can only describe as the bet. Like, like this is probably like every, like, uh, like a therapy, like a therapeutic, like therapist dream of just crashing out on your, on a problem client.

[00:17:37] Yeah, absolutely. It was so good. Like, uh, no, I really think what she actually wants to stay and say instead of what she should be saying in the situation. Yeah, exactly. Um, and then it, it just, as it seems like, like Clark is about to like have turn over a leaf and like let her go and like things are going to be okay-ish maybe. Um, that's when another creature, uh, presumably a still life of, of Clark, uh, comes in.

[00:18:05] That's like horribly warped and taller and is like wearing the, the pirate costume from his store, like of his store mascot, like, um, or theme. Um, and, um, Clark tries to, to calm it down, but it ends up like biting him and just like, and killing him, uh, as Mary flees and escapes. And then they get caught, uh, Mary and the, uh, the, um, pirate Clark get, um, captured by async operatives.

[00:18:34] And then we see, uh, basically Mary, uh, escorted to an interview room in async's, um, offices. Um, and we're kind of left with her, like unsure as to her fate, but then the movie ends with like going back into the back rooms and we see a still life of, of Mary. Um, and that's where the movie ends. So, which you and I have opposite feelings on what that means specifically. Yeah.

[00:19:04] Um, yeah, yeah, you, you can give your, uh, what, what, what's your opinion on that? In my opinion, um, considering the end screen shows like the, the copy of Mary with like her face all messed up in a room that is identical in shape to the investigation room. Um, I personally think that when, uh, Mary and, uh, the, the mascot of Clark were taken, they weren't taken out of the back rooms.

[00:19:34] They were just taken to another section of the back rooms that the async guys are in and they've somewhat fortified it and they're interrogating her in the back rooms because the back rooms knows stuff about the world inside and outside based on memories of the people who are in the back rooms. So she would have had to have remembered that meeting or that interrogation technically, um, or whatever.

[00:20:01] Uh, maybe it's a, uh, what's the term for that military? Um, I can't think of it regardless. Um, she would have had to, the back rooms would have to get that memory from her being in the back rooms. If she, if she left the back rooms, then her mind isn't in the back rooms to get that memory from is what I'm trying to say. Okay. So I don't think she never, ever left. All right. Yeah.

[00:20:29] And whereas my, my view on that is she was pulled out by async through like their, uh, gate that they have. Um, and, uh, and was like basically being interrogated in the real, like in, in our world, in the real world, um, by async and there's operatives, uh, and whether or not she died or she was, she was killed, um, after that interview or not, it's kind of left up in the air because Phil was really like, uh, Phil has no poker face. No.

[00:20:56] That guy was just like, he's just like causing like eyeballing the, uh, the one, the one way mirror or the bucket underneath them. Cause how much he was sweating. Yeah. Um, and, and then it cuts to like Mary, like, uh, Mary's still life in the, in the back room. So I think that it's just like it, we, it like Mary's fate, like she, she, she got out, but like her fate is unknown as to whether she's alive or dead, um, by the company.

[00:21:22] But then we cut away to the back rooms where we get to see her still life, the, the, her, the version of her that the back rooms remembers, because, um, as, as it was kind of right before we got to that point, it was panning through all of the other like architecture and furniture that was like personal to Mary. Um, uh, and then we got like the reveal of like her sitting at a chair or in a chair in the back, uh, in a back rooms version of that interrogation room.

[00:21:50] Uh, and it's the still life version of her. So it's just like this place just made a copy of her because she was like, it remembers her. But that's, that's my theory is that she did get out and there's just now a copy of her in the back rooms. But so, so Aaron, what's your theory? What's your theory on that? I did. I've heard both because my, my friend I went with also was like, oh, they're still in the back rooms during the investigation. That was his takeaway.

[00:22:20] I doing the, the, I only do research for this show. I don't do it for my own podcast, but I, knowing that it's all memory based, I'm, I'm conflicted at how much of what we saw in the air quotes, real world was the real world to a degree. I mean, that's also true. Yeah. Just cause the clouds are so weird.

[00:22:46] Uh, like, uh, there's the scene where he goes to his employees, like, uh, I guess the motel place. Yeah. Yeah. Their, their apartments. I'm like, that sky's so weird. Was it? I wish I noticed that. Damn. I don't know what it looked like. Like, like windows 98 windows XP sort of. Yeah. I honestly, that entire scene, like of him going to like, and like, like walking through

[00:23:10] there that had such a dream core, um, element to it of like, like I've seen that, like I've seen like stuff like that, like that, uh, in that art style or in the, in that, in that sort of filming style for like dream core stuff online, which is very similar to like backroom stuff. It's just like more like, this is like this thing, this, it's this place that's in your dreams. Like, it's like the almost idyllic, but like, there's also like weird duplications or, or weird symmetry, like weird, like perfect symmetry on things.

[00:23:39] But yeah, I, it definitely, that definitely felt very, um, uh, liminal and dream core like that, that scene with the, the motel room. Um, honestly, like even, even, um, uh, Mary's like the, her offices and like her, her home and such felt kind of like that, but that's also might just be like a nostalgic thing for like the nineties element. Since they did quite well, actually, like it felt like this is actually taking place in

[00:24:08] the nineties, you know? Cause they got like all the vehicles and all of the tech seemed pretty accurate. Yeah. Yeah. They didn't, yeah, they didn't do like a, they didn't stranger things that, uh, it, um, it, but, but to the original question of is Mary out, uh, the, in the real world, I, I don't know.

[00:24:34] It's, I, I think seeing them go through the threshold, uh, it might be the thing that says, okay, we're back in the real world. Um, but also it, if we're looking, the whole thing of the backrooms is just like, if someone goes in, if someone makes contact with it, it sort of reads all their memory, their memories and starts making stuff. Yeah.

[00:24:58] Um, so the idea is where did, who remembered Mary? Was it Phil? Are we seeing one of Phil's memories that got turned into her? Oh. Yeah. Because he does travel. Yeah. He does travel through the backrooms back, back in it. Like he's been traveling through the backrooms. So yeah. And that, who built cap or just who made captain Clark? Yeah.

[00:25:25] I've seen a lot of like discussion online since the backrooms movie started, like, like started airing on, uh, started like, uh, popping in theaters of like, is pirate Clark, um, original Clark, like that's been morphed by the backrooms or is it his still life or, uh, in the, in the original backrooms, uh, found footage film, there was something called the organism or like the bacteria, which is like this long gated, um, like stick man figure, basically.

[00:25:55] Um, that was just kind of weird. And, and like, it's just like this oozing black creature. Uh, and, and people were like, is it, is this, is this Clark because of how tall he is and how like, how like more, like much more deformed he is than even some of the other like still lifes. Is this, um, uh, is this, uh, like a bacterium that's become like, or like a combination of the bacteria or the, and the, um, and the still lifes.

[00:26:18] Um, cause it also, what's interesting is, uh, when Clark is explaining about like how, how the still lifes are like, uh, like what they're made of and how they don't feel pain and stuff like that. Um, you see one, first off, uh, angel food cake is ruined for me. I never ate them. I was, I was like, someone's got to chomp into that. I need to see this. Yeah. Oh my God. Just like the whole, like you could eat them. And he like pulls out like a chug.

[00:26:48] It was like, that looked like, like, uh, like, like white, like the, the white fluffy, like angel food cake, but with some like syrup drizzled on it and such. Cause it was like wet and moist. It was like, oh my God. Like, and I, like, I grew up having that, like, as like, like that and like pineapple. And it's like, well, I can never, wow. I'm never looking at angel food cake the same way again. What you could do though, is now forever. Angel food cake is a Halloween treat. You buy it on a Halloween and you make that, you make it look like at the clump that you

[00:27:17] just grabbed with your hand and you put it on a plate. Oh my God. Yeah. Just get some, oh my God. Yeah. It's like, it's made from real still lifes. Yeah. From the freshest still lifes. Um, but yeah, like, uh, so we have that. And then, um, later on when, when Mary has been captured, uh, and like the, the Clark, the pirate Clark's been captured and you, we see him like, he's like wrapped up on a table, like pastor in a room that, uh, Mary passes.

[00:27:44] Um, there's, um, uh, like x-ray, x-ray imagery in the background that shows that it has a brain and like, uh, like a skeletal structure and it clearly hurt. Like it clearly felt pain when, when Mary like, uh, hit, like, like was, was attacking it to like, to get away from it. So like, what is that thing? Like it's something different. Yeah.

[00:28:10] Is it, is it actually different from the still lifes or is it like, yeah, I don't know. Cause yeah, he does specifically say they don't feel pain or anything. Cause like he put that knife through one of them. It's like, he didn't even flinch. And I know there's like wonky time travel in the back rooms too. And I'm just like, to me, I'm just like, well, everything's out the window. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's definitely some. So I guess technically both of them, because like time travel is kind of weird in the back room.

[00:28:40] Everything's weird in the back rooms. Um, it's possible that both Clark and captain Clark are also the same Clark. It's just one of them is from like living in the back rooms for 10, 20 years and him just being distorted in and like, he goes nuts and he's like, he basically just becomes his own mascot from the real world. Yeah. I think you're right because isn't, I think it's, I forget which video it is, but they

[00:29:10] find someone's body covered in like bacteria. Yeah. I think that's like the, one of the first, the earlier like async videos. So it's yeah. Clark, captain Clark. It regular Clark. He's dies there. The back room turns him into that thing. That thing travels back in a loop. Also like maybe like it is like the theory that like, uh, captain Clark is actually, um,

[00:29:37] like the back, the, the, the, the stick man bacteria thing that we see from like the, the found footage of just like, and so like, it's just like, he's decayed or like all like the, the, his humanity is basically like sloughed off and like, or the bacteria is eating all that stuff out of them. Yeah. That could be, yeah. So I can see that possibility. Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely, I also, I kind of jumping around, but I do like, I did like how like,

[00:30:03] uh, I did like, I really liked scientist Phil, but being honest, like, um, the guy's name, the, the actor's name is, um, uh, Mark Duplass and I know him from some other horror movies, uh, called the creep, um, where he plays this very, very eccentric, zany serial killer. Oh, really? Um, who, who, who, who films, uh, who like does like found footage stuff and his performance in that is just so fun, but like also just like unnerving.

[00:30:29] And so it's fun to see like, uh, him play the scientist, uh, who's just like, just like he clearly, he's not in charge. He's just like another, like pawn in Async's, uh, in Async's, um, operations. Yeah. And, and how he finds out about Clark and like, was the, like, cause he sees Clark like through the security camera in early, early on in the movie, like that they have in the back rooms, like in the complex.

[00:30:56] Um, but then later on in the movie, like, he's just like, he's making some popcorn and he's with his family. Like he's out of Async's office and stuff and like just hanging out with his family and they're watching some TV. And then captain Clark's ad for his, for the Ottoman empire Emporium comes on and he just like, wait. I, I just really loved that scene of just him like discovering, uh, the identity of Clark of this guy that like trapped, like, like found his way in the back rooms. It's like, oh no.

[00:31:26] Like he didn't, uh, pursue that at all though. Did he, he just kind of waited till he showed up. Yeah. It's. I, yeah, that is kind of weird. Like I was actually kind of expecting when, uh, when Mary like showed up at the, at the, uh, the, at the store, I was kind of expecting there to be like a bunch of Async operatives. Um, and we, we kind of get it, but it's like, it only happens when we're in the back rooms version of the, uh, the Ottoman, uh, or the, uh, the Ottoman empire, uh, store.

[00:31:57] Um, great name for a store. Yeah. Also, also I gotta say it's great name, but also dumb name because it's like captain Clark's Ottoman empire. It's like those two don't, those two things don't exactly go along together. Like the, one of his employees said that like, like what you're, you're a sultan now you're sitting on like a throne, but you're a pirate. What's the theme here? And he's just like, shut up. Yeah.

[00:32:23] I'm being jealous of like the, the Western theme for salesman. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, yeah. Um, yeah, that was really good. Uh, what else do I have? Okay. So, um, so there's again, a very slow burn horror movie. Um, but I will say when, uh, there's one part of the movie that really got me in terms of

[00:32:51] like being anxious and like getting some anxiety and like dread. And that was the, um, when, when Mary's running from, from captain Clark and goes through that door that has like the, the, the, just the giant, like just pit. And she has to like go along the ledge to the stairs. Um, I have to think that that was a nod to Kane's other work.

[00:33:17] Um, the oldest few where there's an exact, there's almost an exact same scene where the main character in that series is trying to like escape a giant and has to go along an edge, a precarious edge. That's no bigger than like two or three feet. Um, and like, like bawling will kill you and has to get to like a doorway. That's like up on an, uh, up on a, uh, up on a precarious area. And like, that was that whole time I was like, oh my God, I hate this.

[00:33:47] Like my, my, my, my fear, my, my fear of heights was kicking in. Um, like I, I don't do too well. I'm pretty good with, with claustrophobia for the most part, but like, if I see it like a ledge, I get, I start getting like butterflies in my stomach, even in, even in shows, just the fear of falling, I have a fear of heights, but oddly enough, like seeing it in like a film format or video game format or what have you, it doesn't really bother me for some reason.

[00:34:14] It's just when my actual body's on the line and it's like, okay. Yeah. I do get heights are bad for me. Like in a, in the last of us part two, uh, they are a section where they're like crossing this makeshift bridge in Seattle and it's like, oh, I hate this. Yeah. And the death animation is horrible. Yeah. As it should be.

[00:34:43] I remember quick, a slight tangent from the, but like regarding like the fear thing, the fear of falling and stuff like that. I had that with, um, there's this VR thing. I tried at a friend's house, uh, where like I got the, put the VR headset on and all that. And you, you're in an elevator and then the elevator opens and it's just a, a plank of wood that goes over a, uh, Scott, like a, like that goes out off of a, um, a, uh, a high rise.

[00:35:11] And, and I, and I, I, I, I, I, I got to the edge of the elevator. I looked down at like in quotes and I was like, look at the place. Like, I was like, take this off. I'm done like, oh man, no, like I can't, I know, I know it's virtual, but I can't. Your brain doesn't think it's virtual. Yeah. Not when, not when you have like the headset on, but yeah, again, just like, that was like definitely a good, just fear, like kind of anxiety inducing moment for like, in a good

[00:35:39] way, not like, uh, like I hated this kind of thing, but like, it was definitely a good, like strong, uh, sense of urgency and sense of like dread of like the, just like the chase scene. Like it heightened the chase scene even further with like, also gave you the, give you more of the scope of the back rooms with that, just like that huge never ending, like just pit of, of different rooms and stuff that just cuts out.

[00:36:04] I, I, I think what he's figured out, uh, is that not too many people do it in horror recently is that it's like, he, he really did tap into that primal fear of like, I don't see what one, I'm scared of what's around the corner. Yeah. Two. Oh, there's something that is bigger than me and it's coming after me. And caveman brain is activated. Yeah. I am getting, I don't know what this is.

[00:36:34] It's going to eat me. Like she literally saw that it's going to eat you. Yeah. Yeah. You know, like the, I liked how cool, like normal size Clark or like, like regular Clark and like, Oh, it almost seemed like he's like, he had these under control. Like it was like, uh, like, uh, like Owen from Jurassic world, like with the Raptors, like I can, I can, I can control them. Like, yeah. Cause he, he had, he seemed to have control over the, like, or at least like, um, have been able to have like cooperate with the other still lifes.

[00:37:04] Um, and then captain Clark comes in and it's like, it's okay. It's good. It's okay. And then captain clutches gave him a big old hug and then just started cowing down on his shoulder. Yep. Well, from the sounds of it, he was actually quote unquote friends with captain Clark as well. I just think he freaked out because, uh, Mary was there. Oh, maybe. Yeah. Because as soon as he came in, it's like, don't worry. No, she's, she's gonna, I don't remember what he said, but he was trying to justify her being there and she's not a threat and stuff like that. And then he freaked out.

[00:37:35] Yeah, it was definitely, I think, I think from what I've heard and from like what I got the, from that was like, um, regular Clark was ready to like make like to, he, he's, he had, uh, he was ready to make the change, like make a change and just basically like for the better. And like, he was growing as a person and then captain Clark is kind of stuck in the, the rut that like either if he's a remembered version of Clark, like he's stuck in that and doesn't want to change.

[00:38:04] And so like that rage that Clark has like captain Clark also has. So, I think he's like the embodiment of all of his, like the badness in him. Yeah. Especially when, cause like there's the still life that of the red, that the redheaded still life, um, it's definitely his Clark's wife is what I got the vibe from. I think so. I think we see a photo of her earlier.

[00:38:29] Like when he's like, again, sleep, like sleeping in his, in his store and she's got red hair, red hair. So, um, I have a feeling like that was her and she like, she was completely, uh, just like neutral and like letting them like scalp her to put on, to put the hair on, on, um, on, uh, Mary and such like for their, their therapy thing. Um, and then she just freaked out like moments before captain Clark arrived on scene. So like, yeah, yeah.

[00:38:59] Yeah. That's definitely gotta be like a reaction from like, to like that rage. Like, cause again, like we've kind of get hints and stuff that like the reason she got kicked, the reason Clark got kicked out of the house and stuff was because of his, he had a drinking problem and was probably abusive. Possibly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's now that's horrible for still lives. If they're just like, I have these base instincts that I inherited from a memory. Yeah. And that's controlling me.

[00:39:27] Oh, it's like, it's the horror of being a, a, a cardboard cutout or like, or being a photo, like being a, the photograph, like the, like a, a living photograph, like you're stuck in that instance. Like, like video game NPCs. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Like they're repeating the same programming and they have the same like notions over and over again. Yeah.

[00:39:50] I mean, Sean Levy, the director of, uh, uh, uh, free, uh, what's a Ryan Reynolds movie where he's an free guy. Yeah. Yeah. Sean Levy director of that. And he's a producer of this. So, okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Free guy was, yeah. I get like back rooms, like even like with Kim Parsons, like elements of it and like his vision of like it, it does have some gameable elements. Like it does, it does feel like a video game in real life sometimes.

[00:40:18] So like, yeah, I can see that. I do want to call out the, uh, for the still lifes once we're in the kitchen scene, it's the makeup and the wardrobe are so good and how they've sewn the costumes to look like glitches and like, and it's things you, there's a pattern recognition.

[00:40:44] You don't realize it on the, the first shot of like the bigger gentleman. Yeah. About eight. Um, like as you keep cutting to that angle, I was like, oh, his buttons are weird. Oh, there's, there's this going on with his face. That's too many eyelids. Yeah. Yeah. The more you look at them, the more you realize how wrong it is. Yeah, exactly. Oh, have they done any like behind the scenes stuff?

[00:41:12] Like, is that all practical effects or did they do that with CG? I'm not sure about the, about like the still lifes. I assume that's, those are prosthetics. And for the most part, I know, I know the back rooms themselves were built. Um, all of it. Yeah. So, so the thing about this movie was like, so, so, um, Kane apparently like with, with the set directors and stuff like that, he actually taught them how to like, it basically got

[00:41:39] them to learn blender so that he could build the, build the sets in blender and like send them, like send ideas to them for like, for when they were building it in real life. And I know, I think I can't remember how big it was. It's, it's a massive comp like it, like the set, the actual set was huge. Um, I got it pulled up. It's yeah. Wikipedia, which is never wrong. Said, uh, 30,000 square feet. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And they shot, I think they were shooting in Vancouver too. So.

[00:42:11] Yeah. Yes. That's awesome. No, I think the, a lot of the, I think a lot of the found footage stuff might've just been in blender. Yeah. Or a large portion of it. Like when, uh, I definitely when Clark, uh, when the, his kid, when the kid with the camera dies and Clark takes over and he's, I'm just like, well, that's, that's blender. Yeah. Oh yeah.

[00:42:37] With the, the, the title, like the pool room kind of like the tile stuff that, yeah, it did it. I don't want to say this in the bad way. It does kind of look like, like an early, like, like, um, it does look like CG because it's just about glossy it was all or all of it was meant to be, cause it's all like shiny tile. Right? No, exactly. Yeah. But they probably did that because CG does shininess quite well. Yeah. True. Um, also because like they're running through like different locations. Yeah. There's no human actor that needs to be in it.

[00:43:07] So I don't need to build that part of it out. I'd imagine. Yeah. And I also, similarly, I imagined, uh, I know that, uh, I did see, I should see a behind the scenes thing of like certain holes that were like in the, in the floor did have like a green square, like where they'd be. So like, basically they could like comp that comp in like a, uh, the proper, uh, like a digital hole there. Um, and I, I assume the, the giant like cutout pit that she, like, I assume that wasn't

[00:43:36] if that, if that was like physical, like, Holy crap. Oh, that's real. But yeah. It's a big hole in Vancouver somewhere. Yeah. It's going to be a tourist attraction. Yeah. Oh man. Honestly, this movie kind of gives me hope that one day we'll get a live, a movie adaptation of, um, the, uh, mystery flesh pit national park. I don't know if you, if either of you are aware of that one, but it's like basically this, like, it's like super organ.

[00:44:04] It's like you, it's like sort of like a, um, uh, like how Yosemite is like, or which, which Yellowstone is under, uh, has a giant super volcano under it. Um, in, in the premise for this thing, it's, it's a Tumblr and like online, like creepypasta thing of like a giant super organism under the ground, uh, that the government has turned into a national park. Uh, and people can go and hike in the, in the, in the veins and, and musculature of this thing.

[00:44:33] Isn't it basically like, what if Sarlacc pit, but it's fricking massive. What if Yellowstone size Sarlacc pit? Yeah. And they, and like the government's just turned it into a national park. Um, but yeah, I, I, the, the fact that this movie liked it so well, like it gives me hope for some of those kind of like things getting, getting more, uh, getting more recognition and such. Maybe we'll get dogscape the movie. Oh fuck. Oh no.

[00:45:03] I'm not familiar with dogscape. Yeah. Yeah. Dogscape is, is a series of logs where, uh, of survivors, uh, in a world where everything has been, uh, like the entire surface of the planet is dogs. It's all made of like dog faces or like, yeah. Yeah. Like, like if a Shoggoth, um, like, like a giant, like amalgamation of like teeth and mouths and eyes and all that stuff.

[00:45:31] But what if dog and took over the planet, like just completely covered the planet and those who survived are still like just trying to survive with like a world that doesn't have that, like, like how do you survive in a flesh scape basically? Mm hmm. But it's also friend shaped because it's all doggos. It is. Yeah. Oh, and the trees that are like tails that are like wagging, but it's just like a tail sticking out of the ground. Yep. Yeah.

[00:45:59] Um, and there, the, the, the, the ending for it is, is kind of ridiculous, but also kind of like, oh my God, like that's horrifying, but I won't spoil it if you want. Go check it out. Uh, okay. I imagine the planet chases the comet of some sort would be the, the joke ending. Um, it's, it's something, it's something, it's something a little bit more grounded, but like, okay, just as dumb. Okay. Okay. Also should have been a dog. Doggoth should have been the name. Doggoth. Oh yes. Yes. You're right.

[00:46:29] Doggoth. Uh, no, this it's a, I, uh, if you don't know, I am like on the, on the very, very outskirts of film. Uh, I was more into it earlier on in my career than I am now, but I still have friends in it.

[00:46:51] Um, it's, it's a very interesting time where this and also obsession came out so close together. And it's, it's definitely, if you're out there and you have like core on YouTube, you might be getting a call at some point soon. Cause we're definitely going to see a mat.

[00:47:14] We're going to see a mass wave of creepy pastas, uh, YouTubers getting horror movies. Yeah. Like not to bring up another movie, but like iron lung YouTuber took a tiny indie game and made it into a massive, like successful movie. Yeah. And, and yeah, like we, it like that movie, like again, for, for how it was, it was even

[00:47:41] smaller in terms of like, from, uh, cause Kane had, uh, had a 24 Markiplier like had, like he did most of it all, like all of it himself. And like, and like, he didn't like, he didn't option it to like option distribution to, to anybody. Uh, he wanted to have the rights to him like for, for this, this indie project, like very indie. Um, and like, yeah, we went, we actually, me and gamer went to go see that, um, earlier this year.

[00:48:08] And, uh, we, we just happened to luck out in like one of the theaters near us had it, uh, had it showing. And, uh, yeah, it was, it was the most packed I've ever seen a movie theater. Um, I was so surprised when I went, cause I think it'd been weak. It'd been out for weeks and like, and it was a weeknight. Oh man. Yeah. And it was, oh yeah. Yeah. Wow. That's awesome.

[00:48:37] Um, yeah, that just shows like these days, like, yeah, these small little, uh, developments, indie developments and stories and stuff can turn into a full on movie. Like that actually is quite good. And then Hollywood could spend millions of dollars on something and everyone hates it. You know? Yep. Yeah. There's, uh, I, I was free at what podcast, but I was hearing other people talk about how

[00:49:05] it seems like early, uh, idea of YouTube to film or TV was like, oh, this is the most popular person. Well, they need a movie. They need a TV show instead of like, here are the people who are developing that are already within like a film and TV, uh, space. And they're developing, like they're using YouTube to develop on their own. Okay.

[00:49:32] Let's take them and give them a budget and let's push them forward. So it seems so like early on, it seemed like, uh, Hollywood was like, well, what the wrong lesson is there's the most popular that'll translate. And now it's like, well, here's like the most effective artist. Yeah. And let's go with them. Um, yeah. And let's give these people, cause it's like, um, I have some beef a little bit with the Marble Hornets movie.

[00:50:00] Uh, cause that was one of the early, that was another one. Like when it came out, I think near the end of Marble Hornets actual run, um, like 20, I want to say like 2014, 2015, maybe a little bit later. Uh, it's called always watching. Um, 2015 is when the movie came out and I'd heard like a few years. Prior, like, um, the guys who did Marble Hornets on YouTube, again, one of the most

[00:50:25] popular, like Slender, Slender vlog or Slender man, um, uh, series out there. Um, it got optioned by a, by a Hollywood company and they were working on it and like, but the thing with that movie was, uh, the movie wasn't, they didn't, the, the studio didn't, uh, the, the, uh, the Marble Hornets creators, I think were consultants in that. They weren't the ones actually filming it and directing it and like producing it.

[00:50:54] They weren't, um, they didn't have like direct control of the, of the feature film. And I found that movie like didn't have the same like charm and the same like kind of grit as the YouTube series. Um, it felt more like a paranormal activity, uh, movie then like, it still had, it's, it had like just enough polish, unfortunately that it was, it didn't feel genuine, um, Yeah.

[00:51:21] Like probably what happened was like whoever was actually writing the script and the director and stuff like that, they watched a couple episodes of the Marble Hornets, uh, show on, uh, YouTube and like, okay, that's all we need to know. Let's go. Make it like paranormal activity. Yeah. I mean, well, the Marble Hornets, like, uh, I think, uh, Trevor, uh, Troy and, um, Troy Wagner and, uh, um, I can never remember who plays Alex, but he was the other guy that was like the creative mind of, of Marble Hornets.

[00:51:48] Um, Joseph, I want to say, uh, future me add that in right now. Joseph Delage. Oh, yes. Yes. That guy. Um, they, again, they were consultants for the movie. It just, but like, again, they didn't have direct control. Like Kane does, like Kane was, was, um, at the, at the helm for this movie. That's how it should be. You need someone passionate behind the hell behind the helm of whatever you're steering

[00:52:15] or, or maybe cause like there can be people that are passionate about, about a project, but like somebody that's also like, like knee deep in the material. Yeah. Yeah. They have to live, breathe and eat the source material. Yeah. It's interesting you bring that up. Cause I had just watched, uh, like an hour and a half USA on, on Marble Hornets and sort

[00:52:40] of like the, the idea of, I guess, internet IP, especially with like creepy pasta and like ownership and like the Marble Hornets, like behind the scenes is seems crazy. It's, it's fascinating. And also a little like, it's definitely like there's it, it recovered, but there was some like some unfortunateness, some, uh, some unfortunate like issues with like them becoming so big.

[00:53:09] Um, especially since like the series, again, like with that series, like they made the original, like they, they were kind of like pulling it out of their, their ass. The, uh, the original idea, like they were just like every video was like basically them like doing it. And then at a certain point they, they sat down and was like, all right, we need to actually solidify a narrative. Like, what are we trying to do here? I think that was like, like the later season, like basically like if you had to make into seasons, like that was season two was basically, all right, this is what we have so far. This is what we've done.

[00:53:36] Let's sit down and actually figure out what, what, what's the actual like lot that we're, we're, we're trying to do here. So, um, and then, yeah, just like I, and then, and then there's the Slenderman movie from 2018 that came out a little too late and, but also a little too soon. Yeah, no, that was, it's, we, we don't have to talk about Slenderman. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. The horribleness of it. Yeah. Let's, let's, let's, let's not, let's, yeah. So yeah.

[00:54:07] Um, back to, back to back rooms. Oh my God. The least problematic. Yeah. Legit. Um, yeah. Again, yeah, this movie was, it was just, it was so good. Like I, I, I've even had like some issues with like, uh, I, I sometimes have an issue with like a movie that takes different film formats, like found footage, but then like feature, like, like traditional film style.

[00:54:32] Um, and like this one didn't bug me as much as I've seen in other movies where like they, they start with a found footage style or like they, they, they add a found footage style and then it, it, it whiplashes back to like a feature film style. And like this one did like, I think this one just meshed it much smoother. And I think that is also kind of an accredit to Kane's filming. Uh, like, like the way he films makes things.

[00:54:58] It, it felt sort of like very dreamlike or very, uh, very, um, surreal enough that like, yeah, that makes sense. Like we're sort of like meshing between like found footage and like this older, uh, this, this more traditional film feature. And then like some, some shots were like just very like dream-esque as we got like some memories from Mary and her, her childhood and such.

[00:55:22] And, and like you said earlier, the, that, um, uh, that motel or apartments that's like with the, with the little courtyard with all the picking tables and the weird blue, the weird, like a sky, like it just all that compiled enough to make it like just kind of a weird kind of surreal film that it didn't bug me that we were switching between different formats or different like POVs of filming. Yeah.

[00:55:49] Like in my opinion, I don't think it would have been as successful or at least as enjoyable if it was purely through the camera. Oh my God. Yeah. I'm not going to look through the like first person perspective camera. Yeah. Yeah. I, I, I definitely, I now, I'm now just remembering how the movie opens with the, um, the, the async operative, uh, running like the found footage. Right. And I just remember watching that part and I was like, Oh no, like, I hope this movie is

[00:56:18] like, this movie has to calm down on its, on, on, on the shaky cam. Um, it's like, I, I, I would, I remember like back in the day I went and saw like Cloverfield and I didn't like get two motion sickness from that, but the, that, that intro scene there with the, um, uh, as the guys like running through the, the back rooms definitely gave me some like, Oh no, like please let this movie calm down with the, with the motion sickness. Yeah. I guess that's something that I didn't think about. Yeah.

[00:56:46] Cause if it was the whole movie, there'd be people walking out just because they're physically sick. Yeah. And I, and that is sort of like a movie theater issue because like how big the screen is and stuff like watching it on like a regular TV screen would probably be fine when, when, when I get around to, uh, watching it again. Yeah. He, he's, he's very good at mixing formats. Yeah.

[00:57:12] And like, and like, it's already like, you know, shows that on his, on his channel, like you said, with the sort of different types of backroom videos he creates. Yeah. Also, I think he did the score for this movie as well. Didn't he? Like he also. Yeah. No, I've just been like, again, like very rarely do I get, do I try to dig deep in, into movies? Yeah.

[00:57:41] This one got its little hooks in me for sure. A little, a little Captain Clark hooks. Um, nice. But I've, yeah, I've been, the, the score is so good. I've gone back and listened to like his other music. Yeah. From the other YouTube. He's, it's crazy. Yeah. She's doing. For sure. Yeah. Also, I did a quick search. Yeah. It was him and a Canadian composer named Ido van Bremen.

[00:58:10] They co-compose the movie. Oh, nice. Okay. Also, yeah, it looks like, oh, I also, so I'm, I'm, I'm pulling from Wikipedia myself. So I do see that apparently one of the tracks on the, in the movie, uh, was from boards of Canada and that, like that checks out. They're very like this, like that, like their music is very much like something that you would hear in a backrooms movie or a liminal space movie.

[00:58:36] Um, yeah, no, it's just, it was really good. Uh, I, I think I've reached the end of my, my, my notes. Well, what do you guys think about the, uh, the acting that they did? Cause like, I feel like in this sort of movie, if you're told as an actor, I need you. Okay. I need you to look at that wall and be terrified. Like, but like to them, they're just seeing a wall with some tape on it, but you need to

[00:59:05] actually be scared. You just saw someone walk through it. That's not right. Go. Like I, I believed all the acting in it. They did a pretty good, damn good job. I think. Yeah. I, I did like Clark's, um, awe of the, um, of like when he stepped into the movie, when he stepped through the wall and was, it was in the backrooms. Uh, he, he was, he, he, I liked it. I liked how his performance, like the, um, I can't pronounce that actor's name.

[00:59:35] And I'm, I really sorry. Can I, yeah, let's, let's like Clark, the Clark's actor. Like his performance was fantastic. Cause it was like, um, he had enough, like, like confused bewilderment, but awe of like what he was experiencing when he first like walked in, like explored the backrooms.

[00:59:58] Um, and then like later on in the movie, like his whole, like his just like spiral, um, uh, was, was really good. Uh, I also, one, one scene that happens when he first discovers the, um, uh, when he gets, when he gets spooked in the backrooms and runs like back for, back for the, uh, the entryway and goes through. And then like a minute later, like a second later, like runs back in to grab something and grabs the stool and runs back out.

[01:00:27] To prove it to himself. Yeah. I love that because yeah, it's, that's exactly what that scene was, was him. Like, like I I've seen some people like joke is like, Oh, what the fuck? Like, like guy runs, like guys goes in the backrooms and like, and finds an opportunity to like grab a stool. Like, and it's like, no, he wasn't grabbing the stool for like court, like for like for the furniture and stuff. He was grabbing anything, although that is a, like, I gotta say like, that is a smart move. That's all this free furniture. You can sell. Yeah. Damn right.

[01:00:54] Like, but no, he was doing it to like grab onto something so that he could like, but like, uh, like prove that it was real and it wasn't like a hallucination or he wasn't going crazy. Um, yeah, because he went down there in the first place because, uh, the power was like flicking on and off when he was laying in bed, watching TV, half drunk and also half asleep. Yeah, exactly. One could see why he might not believe himself in the morning. Exactly. Yeah. Um, yeah.

[01:01:24] Cause it was very much the same kind of, like, I was kind of reminded of like, there's some love, love craft stories where a character experiences this weird, like dreamlike situation and then comes back to in, like in their bed or like in their, in their apartment and like, Oh, that must've all just been a dream or something. And then they like, something's poking them all like underneath their, their pillow and they pulled the pillow and there's like an artifact that was from that dream realm. Um, there it's like, Oh, it's, it's like, it wasn't just a dream. So yeah.

[01:01:53] I like that like revelation of like, like the proof of revelation there. Um, yeah. Like, like speaking of, of the, the love craftian nature of it, this might be the best depiction of that gradual. Like he, he's losing sanity points. Oh yeah. Yeah. Left and right. But it's the way that, uh, like in a, in a, in a love, in a love crafty and like game

[01:02:20] scenario, but the, the main villain is, or like a cultist, not, uh, is like, they love this thing. They understand it and they've come to accept it. And like this portrayal was that of like, I'm in all of this and, but I still have my wits about me to be scared when I need to be scared, but I'm accepting this and I'm making it a part of me. Yeah.

[01:02:48] Cause like his go-to when he like discovers this place, like, isn't to like get lost in like, Oh no, he's free. Cause he's also an architect, like a failed architect. Sorry. He is an architect. Uh, but he, his, his go-to is to map out the back rooms. And it's like, yeah, it's like, Oh, that's not a good idea at all. I mean, it's, it's both a good idea and a bad idea. Cause then like, we find out like it also like the place shifts sometimes too.

[01:03:18] So, uh, yeah. Um, and then like, there's also like, again, I liked, I was, I was very intrigued by Mary's like backstory with her like mother. Um, and how she like, like we kept going back. Like she'd keep like, she'd like look at some place, like, like her former house, like her former home, like with where her mom, like she had, she had a memory of her. Like her mom and, uh, and her, uh, putting their handprints in the, in the concrete when it was so wet.

[01:03:46] And then her house is getting demolished. Um, and that she actually kept a piece of that. Like, cause like, that was like something that she had, but then we got more like, like the memory started getting darker and darker. Like as, as we went through the movie, like, uh, like her mom was probably an agoraphobe, like fear of outdoors sort of a situation, like to the nth degree. And because, or, or she was afraid of something outside that like nobody else could see, which

[01:04:15] kind of begs the question, like, it was she crazy or was she, or was she like, was there like, was that like a mental illness that happened on its own? Or was that as a result of something maybe she did actually see? Like, I don't think she was actually crazy because like at the end of that scene, like someone bashed the door in, and one like clean hit, knocked the door through. So like something came to get them because Mary as a child looked out the window.

[01:04:44] See, I saw that as the memory getting, uh, like the memory of her, of like what she experienced as a kid getting crashed with the memory of the fact, or the fact that like, uh, Mary knows that, that, that the house was demolished. So like that was actually the demolishing again. Yeah. Yeah. Um, but again, like her mom did kind of like bring up some stuff, like, like there's something outside that she does like that. They're not supposed to go near the windows.

[01:05:09] And I know from some behind the scenes stuff again, that Kane has been like inserting the sun with a face imagery in a lot of his stuff. And like, even that, like the, the red carpet of the, the, um, I guess the red carpet for the movie, um, he had a, uh, a little, a little like pin on him, on his, on his, uh, on his outfit of a sun with a face. And he was like, Oh, don't worry about it. Like I, I like the sun told me I had to wear it.

[01:05:38] Like it was like, it's like, it's sort of like either like an in joke with his discord server or, um, it's, it's something that he's planning on, like maybe like a future project or something that he's planning on tying in to his, uh, his work. Oh, okay. So, but now that like with, but with like, yeah, like Mary's mother and like her kind of psychosis of like not being wanting to go outside, like maybe that has something to tie to that.

[01:06:02] Or again, might just be, uh, a very unfortunate case of agoraphobia, like to the nth degree. Um, so I thought that was kind of, I thought that those like dream seek or those, uh, memory sequences were pretty, were very interesting to add in. Again, this movie is not going to be for everyone. Um, it is, it is a slow burn horror and it is a bit of a thinking piece in certain spots.

[01:06:28] Um, like it does, it does, it definitely becomes a conversational piece, uh, by the end, like you are going to be left with, with questions and like, there's no easy answers. Um, but yeah. And I find that like, that's, that's, that's what's fun about it is like, you get to kind of speculate that stuff. Yeah. The, the, the Mary flashbacks were a little, those are hard to parse just from the, cause

[01:06:55] they were very dream, the dream logic in there, of course, what was there of every memory ended with construction equipment. Yeah. Through. Um, and so it, so it's like what it there's. So I think Kane is kind of a troll. It might be.

[01:07:20] Um, in like, I, I, there, there's so much, I don't want to dig crazy deep into it, but I feel like there's so much unreliable narrator who, a lot of this, uh, especially with Clark. Yeah. Or it's, there's definitely something he's not saying. And the thing that stuck out to me is that in his opening scene, he's at therapy. They do the role play thing. He's just like, Oh, I hate acting.

[01:07:49] I don't want to do any of this. And then the next scene is just like him going a hundred percent as a pirate. Yeah. Oh my God. You're really getting into like the directing of that commercial. So we're already like, like he, I feel like him and Mary are both kind of. I don't know what to believe from you. Yeah. Cause like Mary, like is like, she's a therapist and like, uh, and she's like, so she's selling her own book on like these, these ideas she has, but she doesn't believe it.

[01:08:17] Like she even, I think she even confesses to that at the end, near the end. Like she doesn't believe what, like what she's selling basically. And, um, especially when, well, when push comes to shove, like when a little gun to your head or knife in this case. Um, and, and also like, she's also kind of like, she's, um, coming to grips with, like she has her own traumas that she's trying to grip with and like trying to, uh, rationalize so, or, and trying to like cope with.

[01:08:42] So it's like, is it like the death lead in the blind sort of thing? Mm-hmm. Uh, in a way, like, like, again, like, like you said, like neither of them are trustworthy, uh, um, trustworthy, uh, narrators in this case. Yeah. I, I think back to the, there's the weird party montage with Mary that where it's like, is this her home? Are these her friends?

[01:09:12] You don't, like she has to leave for a minute to take a mysterious pill that she said in a way. Yeah. So it's very open-ended of, of what her actual backstory might be. And nothing went, uh, nothing became of that either. Did it? Well, I think it was, yeah, it could be that like, but she was just taking it to basically like, as like a, like some kind of like anti-anxiety pill or something. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Um, like to, to cope with like, uh, that, that whole social situation, which I mean,

[01:09:42] honestly, I get it. Your emotional battery, like your social battery drains real fast sometimes. Um, but yeah, it's, yeah, I, I, they're, they're the, those two characters, um, unreliable. I really, I kind of liked the employees. Um, I'm not going to lie. I, I really, I really dug, um, uh, what's his name? Uh, Bobby, the, uh, so yeah, so it's Kat and Bobby are the, um, are the employees.

[01:10:12] Um, uh, and Bobby, again, Bobby's kind of like this laid back kind of like kind of stoner guy. And then Kat's just sort of the, um, the, the, uh, what's the, not just desensitized or like the disinterested employee. Cause like she's working at this, like this retail place that like no one's around, they get no customers.

[01:10:36] Um, but when, when Clark drags them into this situation and like Bob or Bobby is just like gung ho about it and catch like rolled sand when she went through. Yeah. It's real busy. Yeah. Yeah. Like her and, and Mary and, uh, kind of like they, like everybody rolled sand when they went through the wall and the, and they're the ones that like, like, like fail the sand check. So they're the ones that are actually seeing like this for what it is and it's not good.

[01:11:06] Um, but yeah, Bobby, like honestly, I hate to say it. I'd probably be Bobby's like, I'd be in Bobby's point of view for the most part. Like I'd be like, yeah. Oh my God. Like the back rooms. Uh, yes. Let's explore it. Let's check this out. This is crazy. Yeah. Cause it, you outside of, outside of us, if, if you have no previous knowledge of what a back room is, it's just like, oh wow. Look at this weird space. Yeah. Of course. Let's go through it. There's not monsters here. Why would there be? Yeah, of course. Right. Exactly.

[01:11:36] Yeah. That's crazy. Now walk through that wall that you shouldn't be able to walk through. Yeah. Hey, yeah. Oh yeah. Now tie this here. We're going to tie this rope around you and, and, and slowly, uh, bring you, uh, slowly, uh, tether you down to this other level. One of my minor criticisms was that the crossing over. And I was just like, this is too many scenes of that. Mary can kind of be a little quicker. We've, we've seen this.

[01:12:07] We've seen it twice already. Of, uh, what was that? Of, uh, Mary's being hesitant about going through the door. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, you know, that, yeah, that was, that was very, yeah. I do remember watching that. I was like, okay, do we really need, like, we get it. But yeah, but realistically, there are, these are four fleshed out characters that are all main characters in one way or another.

[01:12:29] Um, and like, they all would be questioning or like hesitant about walking through a wall, you know? So yeah, it's kind of necessary. It's, it's the give and take of editing. Like when you're, because like, yes, in the, in the, in the setting, like in this, in the story, like it's, it's crucial, but like, there's also like Brevin. Like, yeah. When it comes to actually like video editing and stuff like you want. Yeah. So. Yeah.

[01:12:58] I think just from a pacing standpoint, I'm like, we, we know we've eaten. We're, we're watching this. Um, oh God. Sorry. Oh, just, I think my only other big thing is, uh, when Mary gets in, she sees that someone has done a bunch of, I will say someone has drawn a bunch of stuff on the wall, written a bunch of notes.

[01:13:28] I think people, I think the assumption is that Clark did it. I don't think Clark did it. I don't know who did, but I don't think it was Clark. Yeah. I, I've heard again, like I, I kind of got the impression. It was like, oh, this was something else, somebody else. But then Clark's like shows up as like, oh, maybe he did it. But I have seen people like speculate that like, oh, maybe it's like one of the other ACE. It's like somebody who's like either found their way into the back rooms or it's an async agent.

[01:13:54] Agent that's like gotten trapped in there because we're seeing that like the captain Clark is eating somebody or like, or grabbed onto like a yellow. There's a, uh, I think there's a couple of like images of like, uh, of, uh, of the, uh, the yellow hazmat suit guys. Yeah. And the, the giant captain Clark is like either eating them or throwing them or grabbing them and such. So. Was the art on the wall depicting captain Clark? I remember being kind of just a vague black outline.

[01:14:23] It's a silhouette of a very tall like figure with what looks like a pointed hat, like a, like a, like a captain's hat. Yeah. I was just going to say, yeah, are you right? It did have like a pointy sort of head to him. Yeah. At the time I thought it was more like meant to be a beak, but again, it's a silhouette that's kind of like a cave drawing on that one. So it could be anything. Yeah. Or rather it's meant to be kind of vague. Isn't it? I have it up right now. Yeah.

[01:14:53] I'm looking at it. I'm looking at a blurry glory. Yeah. Uh, he's on a three. He is on a throne like a sultan. Yep. Yeah. I don't, I just, again, seeing we've seen his drawings. Yeah. Before. So it is like, I don't. You know, the argument can be made that his faculties were changed while being in here,

[01:15:24] but, um, like some, but like, I don't think it's a backrooms creation. Cause again, I'm like, it's, there are brushes, there's paint cans. There's a ladder, I think in one shot. Yeah. Like there's definitely like implicated. Like there, this was somebody's, like somebody did this, like that was in the backrooms, not the backrooms didn't duplicate this from something else.

[01:15:45] Um, oh, it's like, uh, was the, um, yeah, like I'm looking at it like right now and even, so there's a thing in this movie that it doesn't be because it's kind of got like a dreamlike surrealness. Time doesn't exactly flow very well. We, we, we talked earlier about like how time doesn't work in the backrooms very well or it's different.

[01:16:09] Um, cause I got the impression that like, um, Mary, it only been like maybe a day or so for Mary, like before she went like looking, checking on, checking in on, um, on, on Clark. But he's definitely been in the backrooms longer than a day or so. Yeah. Like his level of like praise, uh, of, of descent into, into madness is definitely like the result of, of longer exposure.

[01:16:36] I feel there was a lot of mail. Yeah. Also, yeah, I think this might actually be Clark that's doing this art because like, I'm looking at it myself too. And it says like the floor plan changed again. Roof is wrong. Roof is wrong. So like, I feel like it might actually be him because he's a, an architect and B, he was actually mapping the place out, but see also anyone else that would go into the blackrooms would also be trying to map it out as well. So I don't know. Yeah.

[01:17:08] What would be interesting if like, it's also like, even like it's more than one person has like contributed to it maybe even. Oh, actually I should continue reading this. I don't know who signed the plans, but the handwriting looks like mine. Oh. Or like, there's the one I saw, I remember like one that stood out to me. It was like down at the bottom. Uh, let's see if I, uh, why thinking, why think in terms of magic, be realistic here.

[01:17:34] And now is a two way street that I like, I just love that as a line. Like that, that is definitely a line. Yeah. Sorry. Oh no. Just, I'm also reading of like tables don't bleed blood. Oh, you're right. Yeah. Yeah. It's yeah. It just feels. Again, it's the going back to like, I think Kane is kind of a troll.

[01:18:02] Uh, cause there have been several interviews where he's like, Hey, everything's intentional. And like, absolutely not in a, in a movie. To have as much control as you say you do. I, I don't believe it. Um, so like, yeah, did he, cause that's the question is like, is Kane picking out every little thing that's on this wall? Cause he knows people are going to do this exact thing.

[01:18:32] Probably. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. He, he's, he's, he's been around the internet for like, for a while. Like he's, he's, I like to think that like, he's probably steeped in, in like this, this internet horror element, like for, for what he's created, like between like, again, the oldest view, the, um, the back rooms found footage stuff and all that stuff. Um, he, he, he, I think he's even like, he's, um, like, what was it?

[01:18:58] The diogenesis of like, of like icebergs and of like, of all of those, like, of like, of, uh, and, and like theory, theory crafting and such. Like he knows what he's doing. Like he knows his audience. I feel true. And like these, this is also very easy to change in post. Yeah. If it's not just entirely made in post production. Yeah.

[01:19:23] Um, I also know that like, uh, this, this is also from the original like, uh, videos, but even in this, like this mural is very reminiscent of, um, of, uh, a confirmed, um, inspiration for the back rooms, uh, that Kane Parson had, which was portal and the, the rat man, um, uh, murals that you'd find. So in, in the, in the video game portal, um, you're, you're going around this, again, a very strange liminal, um, testing facility.

[01:19:53] And occasionally you can go in, in behind like the walls where a surviving, uh, scientist, uh, existed for a while. Um, you never see, you never see him like physically, but you, you, you find where he's been hiding out in the, in the, uh, in the, um, aperture science labs. And he has these murals. Um, so, um, yeah, I, I could definitely see these like those, that, those, that was definitely

[01:20:19] an inspiration, I think for the, for a lot of the, the weird like scrawlings and murals that we see in Kane Parsons back rooms. And then certainly this. Yeah. He, he got me. I'm thinking way too much about it. Yeah. I'm just, it was fun too. I just went over to the, I went back to the, the wiki, uh, wiki page on, on my tabs and it's, it's just his frigging face next to the development section. Uh, just like that smug face. Just like, yeah, you're thinking too hard about this.

[01:20:49] Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. I think that that's, I think that's everything I wrote down for some of the talking points. Yeah. I like, I also like how our, um, our discussion was about as, uh, kind of all over the place as the back rooms. It's fitting, honestly. Yeah. I think that's very, uh, very fitting. Mm hmm. Yeah. The way to do it. Yeah. Um, gamer, do you have anything else to, uh, that, that hasn't been brought up? I think that's about it.

[01:21:19] I would say that all the notes that I had, but I could have said that at the very start of the story, the start of the recording. Cause I didn't write any notes for this one. Yeah. Yeah. This one was definitely like more of a free form. Like just like, if you have some notes and an idea, like basically we're just trying to get our like thoughts. Cause the movie's still, I think it's still, it should still be in theaters when this gets posted. Um, Aaron, you're, you're all good, right? Or do you have anything else you want to bring up? No. Uh, this rules. Yeah. You should go watch it for sure.

[01:21:50] Yeah. Yeah. So yeah. Final thoughts. Uh, yeah. I couldn't agree more, honestly. Um, uh, like I said at the beginning, this, I went into this movie after seeing, cause I went like a week before I went and sell the movie, I watched all of the backroom stuff by, by Kane pixel. And then I went and saw this movie and it was exactly what I wanted it to be for that. It was like, it, it meshes, it works in conjunction with, um, the backrooms film of

[01:22:18] videos that, uh, that Kane has made on YouTube. And of course that was intentional. Like he has said, uh, um, again, uh, in interviews that like the movie and his YouTube channel are like, they can work in tandem. Um, like they are in, they're basically in the same universe. Um, and yeah, the only, yeah, like it's may not be for everybody.

[01:22:43] Um, but if you're a person that likes liminal spaces and like that internet horror and slow burn surreal dreamlike horror, um, this is, this is up there. Uh, like I, I, yeah, I recommend this one for sure. Yeah. And honestly, same. Like, uh, to what you said, like I've seen, uh, backroom stuff and I didn't 100% know what I was going to get into for this, how they were going to handle it. But, uh, yeah, I enjoyed it.

[01:23:12] There were a lot of yellow walls as the gamer in yellow. I have to give it a thumbs up because of that. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. Might be a little biased. And the ceilings are yellow. Everything. I think it's a little biased there gamer, but yeah, I'll let stand. I should really like do, I should do one of my rooms in my house, just a hundred percent backroom style. Don't mention it either. No. Yeah. You just come over one day and be like, um.

[01:23:41] Oh, one, one thing I do want to bring up, um, because you just, you were just brought up about like putting, making a wall of, of backroom stuff. Um, I got to put it out there for the, uh, or like I got a hand. I sent it to them for the, um, the advertisement, like leading up to the movie where they had people in, uh, hazmat suits, like in the ASIC hazmat suits, putting up blue tape on

[01:24:05] walls at, at like known, um, locations across North America where, uh, where like a, where a liminal space that were like famous for like liminal space photos. Really? That's awesome. Like, like there's a, there's a, there's a, there's an indoor like apartment, like hotel. I think it's from like an airport somewhere. Um, where it's like that, it's a very famous, like liminal space backrooms, like a photo

[01:24:31] of like, uh, basically apartment complex in a courtyard, but it's clearly inside somewhere. And you, there's footage of people, uh, there's footage of ASIC hazmat suit guys said it, putting up blue tape on, on the walls there. That's sick. And that's just, that's just a smart, that's just smart. Like to, to get ahold of that kind of advertisement. Cause like people online that want to, that like are into the backrooms and liminal spaces are going to jump on that.

[01:25:02] Mm-hmm. So it's such a simple thing to have as your ad for the movie, like get some blue tape and just make a door on the wall. Like it's so simple. Yeah. Um, yeah. So, uh, yeah, I guess that'll, that'll do it for tonight. Um, Aaron, do you have a, anything you'd like to promote before we, uh, we called, we, uh, bring this to a close. Um, I have a few things. First of all, there is a doggy daycare called the dog scape. Oh God. Oh no.

[01:25:32] There, that was maybe the fourth result on Google. No. Awesome. So depending on your preference, do or don't take your dogs there. Yeah. Yeah. No. Uh, if you, if you want to find it, first of all, thank you both for having me. I, I specifically messaged a review cultist to please let me be on this sort of podcast if you're doing it. Yeah. So I appreciate the invite. Um, you can find me online at Kame House Party.

[01:26:02] Uh, my Dragon Ball Watch Along improv comedy podcast that I do with Vince White. We are past 400 episodes. We are insane. Uh, same. Yeah. Yeah. 400. I've seen y'all's recent. We're all crazy here. I was, I was going to comment. It's like 400 episodes. Those are rookie numbers, sir. With our 630 second episode. Yeah. Oh, um, you can also find me on thinking too hard about anime with Noah Cardin, where we

[01:26:31] do exactly that. Our new season just started. We're watching a bunch of anime movies. Um, and then for the, for the more horror minded, you can find me on YouTube, Aaron J. Shelton. Um, I have very little up there at one short up there now, which you should check out. Um, but more to come, uh, sort of a, a behind the scenes of trying to submit shorts to festivals.

[01:26:56] It usually means I can't show it online for like a year. Oh, we need to hear back. Yeah. Uh, hopefully this year there'll be much more on that channel. Awesome. All right. Uh, and then, yeah, uh, for us at Al Dente, um, uh, you can, well, you can check me out on blue sky, um, at review cultist, uh, gamer refuses to use social media, but honestly, that's probably for the best. Yeah. Oh, good. Yeah.

[01:27:26] Yeah. Honestly. Yeah. Like I migrated from the other site to blue sky. Um, but even then, like I'm terminally online. Yeah. Um, and, uh, if you'd like to send us, uh, emails, you can go to Al Dente, you can send them to send them to us at Al Dente, Riga Mortis at gmail.com. That's a L D E N T E R I G A M O R K S at gmail.com. Where you can also have suggestions for other creepy pastas, SCPs, spooky things, you creepin it, we'll peep it.

[01:27:56] Yeah. Yeah. Uh, and if you'd like to help support our show financially, you can go to Patreon. Uh, we have special episodes, early access, extra content to all our listeners helping support the show. Thank you immensely. You're helping keep those hosting bills at bay, like, uh, like a bacteria or a still life running at us. And we very much appreciate it. Um, and to our listeners, uh, and I guess the creators of these, of these movies and shows, uh, thank you immensely.

[01:28:26] Cause without your listenership, it'd be like screaming into the void of 6 million miles of endless corridors. Um, That's a very static number. Yeah. I think it's very much an infinite symbol on that number. Well, I think that's actually like, I thought that was actually the, the number that they put up for the original backrooms, like quote. Oh really? Yeah. Hang on. I'm just not to, not to, not to stop us for a second, but we're going to stop. Oh, the, the post. Yeah. The post. Yeah. Yeah. Here, yeah, here it is.

[01:28:55] It's, um, uh, approximately 600 million square miles of randomly segmented empty rooms. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Like screaming to the void of that 600 million square miles. Uh, and again, without, without Kane Parsons, uh, YouTube channel, uh, and his career there and this new movie and whatever he does in the future, we really wouldn't have much of a show because we'd have nothing to talk about. So thank you.

[01:29:24] Uh, now's a good time to bring up that we are a part of a podcast network, uh, crit in the night, a actual play and creepy pasta podcast network. We're there alongside our sister podcast, one less die and our cousin podcast, the role playing exchange for things that go crit in the night. Uh, until next time I have been your host review cultist. I'm the gamer in yellow. I'm so Aaron J. Shelton.

[01:29:51] And this has been al dente rigor mortis sleep. Well,